An Interview with Mrs. Astor

Mrs. Astor from the life sized portrait by the celebrated French painter, Carole’s Duran, now in Mrs. Astor’s Fifth Avenue home.

The Leader of the New York “Four Hundred,” through “The Delineator,” Sends Her First Message to the Public 

Mrs. William Astor, the oldest living member of the Astor family, who has just retired as supreme head of that exclusive set known as the New York “Four Hundred,” gives to this issue of “The Delineator” her first interview on public affairs in fact, it is her first public utterance. When the question of selecting the New York Social Register became a matter of necessity, the Astor family was found to be the oldest in New York, and so it was given precedence, and its oldest member was naturally the social leader. 

By virtue of this position she was simply Mrs. Astor, it never being necessary for her to use or sign any other name. Indeed, it would have been a breach of one of the old rules of social etiquette. Here, for the first time, Mrs. Astor tells the American people what she thinks abouť a great many subjects that are foremost in their minds. She talks very freely and very frankly, and the interview is all the more remarkable in view of her extreme conservatism and the fact that she has always successfully discouraged newspaper prominence. Mrs. Astor was Caroline Webster Schermerhorn, when in 1855 she was married to William Astor, a grandson of the first John Jacob Astor.

ABOUT two years ago I found myself in New York, having just returned from Europe, where I had been living for a number of years. There were many pleasant things in store for me on my return home, and chief among them was an interview with Mrs. Astor. I had looked forward to it for a long time, since I much admired her, not only because of her leadership in New York and Newport society, but because I had heard through her friends so many tributes to her simplicity and charm and her many intellectual interests.

Mine was an unusual opportunity for meeting her. She was aware of my appreciation of her, and she knew that she could trust me. Then, too, it happened that she was interested in many of the people and the things I had just come from; one subject led to another, and we went from scenery to society, from art to artists, from politics to the philosophy of life. I was especially impressed with her wide range of thought and her independence of judgment, by her graceful manner and choice diction. restraint and tact were as remarkable as her her to use or sign any other name. Indeed, it would have been a breach of one of the old rules of social etiquette. 

Here, for the first time, Mrs. Astor tells the American people what she thinks abouť a great many subjects that are foremost in their minds. She talks very freely and very frankly, and the interview is all the more remarkable in view of her extreme conservatism and the fact that she has always successfully discouraged newspaper prominence. Mrs. Astor was Caroline Webster Schermerhorn, when in 1855 she was married to William Astor, a grandson of the first John Jacob Astor.

Her courage of utterance. Enthusiastically patriotic, she did not hesitate to condemn certain phases of American life as seen in New York; but she was full of opti- mism for the future. Her own intimate knowledge of America was limited to New York and Newport, she said, and she did not allow herself to make sweeping generalizations about America or Americans.

“I Believe in a Republic”

She said she welcomed particularly what seemed to be a reaction in favor of dignity and decency in New York journalism; that it was only a few years ago that certain quiet, inoffensive women like herself were in constant terror of the papers. For that reason, she had not seen a journalist for twenty years or more. “As far as I was concerned,” she said, “they were never unkind, but rather too kind. 

I would say ‘Good morning’ in the drawing-room to some cultivated young woman or an immaculate young man, and the next day’s paper would have two or three columns of things I never even imagined! There is a good deal in English journalism that we hope to see in New York, particularly the high sense of honor and personal responsibility that English journalists manifest. “Although I have been in Europe a great deal, I and personally supervise their education at home dur- ing the critical early years. They are in love with their husbands and devoted to their interests.

“Yes, I have heard that our young women smoke and drink and do other terrible things. I know a great many of them and know them very well, I have known them since they were born, and I am quite sure there is not one in my circle who is a cigarette fiend or who drinks to excess.”

One of the principal reasons for Mrs. Astor’s life-long interest in society, she said, was her interest in young people. She enjoyed having them about her, enjoyed planning for their amusement. But she said that she felt also that a woman placed by birth or marriage at the head of a great family had no uncertain ‘call of duty to maintain the dignity of the old name.

“That consists in setting a standard for true living in the private life as well as in the public,” Mrs. Astor continued. “One must have high ideals and do the best one can to realize them. My ideals in society have always been very definite. I have not realized them, but who does realize his ideals in this world?”

Circus-Tent Entertainments

“I am not vain enough to think New York will not be able to get along very well without me. Many women will rise up to take my place. But I hope my influence will be felt in one thing, and that is in discountenancing the undignified methods employed by certain New York women to attract a following. They have given entertainments that belonged under a circus tent rather than in a gentlewoman’s home. Their sole object is notoriety, a thing that no lady ever seeks, but, rather, shrinks from. Women of this stamp are few in New York, but, alas! they are so appallingly active! They have done untold harm to the good name of American society in the minds of foreigners. 

When a distinguished man arrives from the other side, he is seized upon relentlessly, although possibly a total stranger to his hostess, and plunged into a mad whirl of extraordinary festivities. He enters upon them with much the same spirit that we would have as spectators of an Indian war-dance. And thus he forms his opinion of all of us. 

I have never entertained a foreigner in my life unless he came to me with a letter of introduction. “The best women in New York society, those of the greatest influence and those who give it its true tone, are almost unknown outside of their own circle. Society newspaper notoriety is interesting to them as it is to me, as a study, a very amusing one, too, sometimes, as one gains so much information about certain women supposed to belong to us, but whom we never see and do not know even by sight.” 

Some American Impossibilities

Mrs. Astor’s ideal of society, she said, was the old French salon in the heyday of its power and prestige. Then history was often made where charming and intellectual women held court attended by the most
distinguished statesmen, poets, artists and financiers, and elegance and breeding were as imperative as reading and writing. “The political hostesses of London have a much better chance of realizing such an ideal today than we women of New York. Over there you find at the big balls and musicales a brilliant array of cabinet ministers, journalists, ambassadors, men and women of the stage, painters and poets, and the powers of the money world such as no leader in New York could bring together or would attempt to bring together thought of doing it all my life, but have never seen the possibility of success. 

In the first place, we have too many politicians in America, where in England they have statesmen. Many of our senators and congressmen seem to base their title to public favor upon their uncouth manners and lack of refinement, upon the fact that they have discarded socks or once wore blue jeans. If they were all like Mr. Roosevelt, what a difference there would be! Mr. Roosevelt is a true American, but he would be at home in the most elegant court in Europe. He is not above paying scrupulous attention to his wardrobe and his manners. Any hostess in New York or Newport would be proud to entertain him, and the men in Washington like him.

“Many people seem to think I could have done a great deal in making New York society as democratic as it is in London and open to any one of intellectual attainments, as it is over there. But one can do only one’s best under the conditions. English people all recognize a certain authority in social matters. The King is the leader of society, and the hostesses who gather about them such brilliant men and women can be as independent as they wish to be without assuming the responsibility of an onslaught upon their own domains. The King’s authority is never questioned, and the authority of the great old families is never questioned.

“We have to be more exclusive in New York because in America there is no authority in society, and Americans in general are not inclined to admit its possibility. Each woman is for herself and trying to outdo the others in lavish display and mad extravagance, with little thought of any ultimate good or any ideal.”

A Woman of Ideals

She came back so often to that word “ideal”! Mrs. Astor is a woman of ideals, and when she talks of them her face lights up in a marvelous way. Her face- how shall I describe it? It was youthful with enthusiasm, the gray eyes sparkled with animation, prepared, even eager to meet a young girl on her own ground of vigorous buoyancy and vivacity.

Very vividly do I recall my first sight of her and the picture she made as she came slowly down the broad marble stairs, not with any apparent feebleness, although a jeweled hand grasped firmly the iron balustrade. She was smiling cordially beneath the big black hat and lace veil, dressed entirely in black, unrelieved even by the conventional white at neck and throat. The gown was cut severely plain, and out-lined a youthful, supple figure, not in the least inclined to embonpoint. As she advanced, I saw that she was about medium height, a little less, perhaps, and as straight as an Indian. 

The head, well set on the rather broad shoulders, was carried high, not with arrogance but good breeding. The waves of soft black hair were youthful, too. But youth does not have the deep, sweet lines of resignation that characterize Mrs. Astor's face, nor the gentle light of her eyes, the light that comes to a woman with motherhood, and glorifies her ever afterward if she be true to that motherhood. 

The smiles of youth are not those that come bravely forth after tears have been shed and battles fought in the inner sanctuary of the soul’s retreat, the tears and the battles which are inevitable to, maturity. Whatever impassiveness Mrs. Astor may consider necessary to assume on usual occasions was thrown aside for the moment, and in her face the true woman shone forth.– In the San Jose Mercury-News, article by Rebecca H. Insley, September, 1908

🍽Etiquette Enthusiast, Maura J. Graber, is the Site Editor for the Etiquipedia Etiquette Encyclopedia